jacobobryant 2 days ago

Hey HN. Since this has showed up here maybe a status update would be interesting? This continues to be my main side project--amusingly it's had more traction than any of the startups I tried to build with it. Over the past year I've been working on some experimental features for Biff that are meant to help with medium-to-large codebases[1] (I've been doing this as I rewrite one of my Biff apps from scratch). There haven't been many code releases in that time, so I've got a decently sized backlog of things I'd really like to get to. E.g. XTDB v2 is almost out of beta; once I finish the app rewrite, that's next on my list.

[1] https://biffweb.com/p/structuring-large-codebases/

  • thenobsta 18 hours ago

    I've played around with Biff. It's an amazing project and a great way to get started with web-development in Clojure. Clojure can be kinda confusing because of the community defaults to orthogonal libraries. Biff, makes it easy to see which libraries are useful to connect up.

    Thanks for the great work!

  • pkphilip 2 days ago

    Thank you for doing this. I am just checking out the Biff framework.

    One part I would change is the dependence on htmx for html generation. I would really prefer an external template file into which we can replace fields

    • playworker 2 days ago

      I might have misunderstood your comment but I don't think that's what htmx does, it just adds reactivity without needing to write JS, the HTML is represented in the project using Hiccup syntax which is essentially HTML in Clojure data structures - makes sense when code is data is a big part of the Lisp idea. It is an external template file into which you can replace fields, it's just a Clojure file too.

Daviey 2 days ago

How often do the batteries need to be replaced?

  • jb1991 2 days ago

    “Batteries included” is an expression referring to technical dependencies and other matters and is not to be taken literally.

    • stonemetal12 a day ago

      I took it as a poke at how short lived batteries-included web frameworks seem to be in clojure.

    • Daviey a day ago

      Do you have an example of a Clojure web framework that doesn't include batteries?

      ie, does https://luminusweb.com/ (or it's successor Kit, https://kit-clj.github.io/) includes batteries? They provide integrated solutions with templating, database access, authentication, and other common web application components pre-configured.

      It's one of those weasel phrases that is poorly defined and has unclear boundaries.

      I think Python first used it for the entire ecosystem:

        'The Python source distribution has long maintained the philosophy of "batteries included" -- having a rich and versatile standard library which is immediately available, without making the user download separate packages. This gives the Python language a head start in many projects.' 
      - https://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0206/

      So anything which doesn't require downloading separate packages, and provides a rich and versatile standard library is "batteries included"? Hugo in Golang, or Jekyll in Python are certainly batteries included then. Should all of them add this to their strapline?

      The distinction becomes less clear when frameworks offer plugin ecosystems or when they're built atop other "batteries included" platforms. This creates a spectrum rather than a binary classification, leaving me quite skeptical of this adoption of marketing language.

  • adityaathalye a day ago

    Rarely. Given the stability of the language and its library ecosystem.

  • hk1337 a day ago

    “Why don't you make like a tree and get out of here?”

slifin a day ago

Nice to hear about Pathom being incorporated

wpeterson a day ago

[flagged]

  • lucyjojo a day ago

    plenty of us out there

    and we'll probably keep slugging parens til' our beards are long and greyed and robes dull and frayed... right to the tomb i say right to the tomb.

  • uludag a day ago

    Clojure is alive and well. It may be out of its peak hype but it's cruising down the plateau of productivity.

  • yogthos a day ago

    Usage has only been growing in my experience, I've never had a problem finding a Clojure jobs having used it for over 15 years now. Do you live under a rock or something?

hk1337 a day ago

"You got my homework finished, McFly?"

It looks interesting. I really like clojure when I tried it long ago but never had a good use for it.